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Mike,
Had both mine, the second about a week ago. Got the Moderna as that's what they had at the time. Nothing after the first, but after the second the day after I felt like I was 100. Spent the whole day in pjs. Hope yours turns out well.....Harry
 

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Discussion Starter · #103 ·
That was 8 gallons over I don't know how many years. I'd STILL be donating but I had a dental skin graft procedure a few years back (actually two separate ones) and that disqualified me. Then I had a Basal Cell skin cancer removed last summer so there goes another year :roll:
My Dad went from the WPA (Great Depression) to the Army. His records were among the many destroyed in some kind of huge government fire (those seem to be so convenient) in the early '60s.
I know from his original discharge papers that I have and from his own stories that he took part in the 1941 Carolina War Games, that he saw action in the North Africa Campaign, that he received a bronze star and a purple heart. The best I can figure is the bronze star may have been from his part in capturing and recovering a German tank, and the purple heart came from hitting a land mine on a motorcycle. He was with a Quartermaster Corp, and then a Military Police unit. He had applied to the Army Air Corps in early 1942, but wasn't accepted (I probably wouldn't be here if he had). Dennis
P.S. on shots. I forgot until this morning, I also have to do my Shingles vaccination again. I got the first one about 2-1/2 years ago, but then they has supply issues :roll: :roll: and I was unable to get the second in the prescribed time.
 

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Discussion Starter · #104 ·
Got my first vaccination today. Took 3-1/2 hours, but was well organized at one of our local Health Department locations. I had tried getting an appointment through Publix (a Florida supermarket chain) and CVS a local / southern drug store chain. Both were a complete frustration and waste of time. Publix ONLY accepts appointments online, and then at 7:00 on Wednesday morning. CVS, I went through all the online questions, hit submit and it said there was no vaccine in my area (they are vaccinating people left and right :roll:).
While waiting this morning, a local news reporter was there asking questions. I gladly threw CVS and Publix under the bus. Several others shared similar experiences. What I had found frustrating was, it was 65 and older for the longest time (I was 64). They dropped it to 60 and older for ONE WEEK, but I was out of town. Then 55, then 50 all in the same week. At least it's over and I automatically have an appointment for my second shot next month. Dennis
 

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amazing how many have taken it...and quite a few who haven't..and won't...and the ongoing attempts to 'bribe' citizens into receiving one of the 3 vaccines...
 

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Skeletor said:
amazing how many have taken it...and quite a few who haven't..and won't...and the ongoing attempts to 'bribe' citizens into receiving one of the 3 vaccines...
That's great! I'm amazed at how many have not taken it. I understand the skepticism (even distrust) of the government. I understand and cherish personal liberties. But when my "choice" may be lethal for others, it's no longer just about me.

My suggestions to those who won't vaccinate --
  • Don't get around others...[/*]
  • If you must get around others, wear a mask (but I know better, it's generally the anti-vaxxers who are also anti-maskers)...[/*]
  • If you don't wear a mask -- DON'T EXHALE![/*]

There. Too bad I can't enforce that one!

Jack
 

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JoeIsuzu said:
Skeletor said:
amazing how many have taken it...and quite a few who haven't..and won't...and the ongoing attempts to 'bribe' citizens into receiving one of the 3 vaccines...
That's great! I'm amazed at how many have not taken it. I understand the skepticism (even distrust) of the government. I understand and cherish personal liberties. But when my "choice" may be lethal for others, it's no longer just about me.

My suggestions to those who won't vaccinate --
  • Don't get around others...[/*]
  • If you must get around others, wear a mask (but I know better, it's generally the anti-vaxxers who are also anti-maskers)...[/*]
  • If you don't wear a mask -- DON'T EXHALE![/*]

There. Too bad I can't enforce that one!

Jack
Joe, I don't think most of those who are skeptical about this vaccine are your typical antivaccine folks. This vaccine hasn't gone through a fraction of the trials .etc any medication is normally required to go through. I think that is a lot of what is causing the skepticism.
 

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JoeIsuzu said:
Skeletor said:
amazing how many have taken it...and quite a few who haven't..and won't...and the ongoing attempts to 'bribe' citizens into receiving one of the 3 vaccines...
That's great! I'm amazed at how many have not taken it. I understand the skepticism (even distrust) of the government. I understand and cherish personal liberties. But when my "choice" may be lethal for others, it's no longer just about me.

My suggestions to those who won't vaccinate --
  • Don't get around others...[/*]
  • If you must get around others, wear a mask (but I know better, it's generally the anti-vaxxers who are also anti-maskers)...[/*]
  • If you don't wear a mask -- DON'T EXHALE![/*]

There. Too bad I can't enforce that one!

Jack
Your arguments are crafted to argue against people that don't exist, framed in a context that is not based on reality. Sadly, you are not alone.

That's not meant to be insulting.

I'm not going to get into it here though, because this is one of the few places I go that isn't riddled with everyone's stupid and completely unsupported political ideologies, and frankly I'd like it to stay that way.
 

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Enemigo said:
JoeIsuzu said:
Skeletor said:
amazing how many have taken it...and quite a few who haven't..and won't...and the ongoing attempts to 'bribe' citizens into receiving one of the 3 vaccines...
That's great! I'm amazed at how many have not taken it. I understand the skepticism (even distrust) of the government. I understand and cherish personal liberties. But when my "choice" may be lethal for others, it's no longer just about me.

My suggestions to those who won't vaccinate --
  • Don't get around others...[/*]
  • If you must get around others, wear a mask (but I know better, it's generally the anti-vaxxers who are also anti-maskers)...[/*]
  • If you don't wear a mask -- DON'T EXHALE![/*]

There. Too bad I can't enforce that one!

Jack
Your arguments are crafted to argue against people that don't exist, framed in a context that is not based on reality. Sadly, you are not alone.

That's not meant to be insulting.

I'm not going to get into it here though, because this is one of the few places I go that isn't riddled with everyone's stupid and completely unsupported political ideologies, and frankly I'd like it to stay that way.
Exactly!!!! This is about Isuzu's and not politics BUT since he threw that out there its ok in my opinion to point out that it's total BS. I worked in pharma for years and know how drugs come to market. I have seen many drugs rigorously trialed and approved, only to be pulled from the market years later for adverse events not seen in trials. This drug was rushed because the perceived danger of a virus with a ridiculously low death rate. It is an experimental vaccine and frankly it is criminally insane to coerce or force, particularly young people (most of which have already had it and have antibodies), to take this vaccine. If you are at high risk then it makes sense to take the vaccination as the benefit probably outweighs the risk. The "science" the left likes to blab about constantly is clear and it is NOT on their side. Now if this virus was as virulent as ebola or something like that then the good outweighs the bad approach probably makes sense. Simply not the case here. Same thing for masks. The actual science and not the pseudo political science proves that masks cannot prevent the spread of a microscopic virus. It is absolutely absurd and frankly stupid. Lastly there is evidence that vaccinated people are carrying transmitting the virus as well as in some cases contracting symptomatic covid. It is open for debate as to why governments are pushing these policies and I will not go into that but the real science here has nothing to do with it.

I am thankful you do not have the power to enforce your opinion. Sadly there are plenty of scumbag politicians that enjoy wielding power and controlling people.
 

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Discussion Starter · #110 ·
Wow. Hadn't checked this post for a while. While I support people's CHOICE whether to get vaccinated or not, I also support the government's REQUEST for unvaccinated people to WEAR MASKS. We wear clothes don't we? I just finished 4 close family members going through Covid. NONE were vaccinated. Now have several close friends, all non vaccers, who have covid. This isn't political, this is serious. I personally got the shot because while not thoroughly "tested and approved", the results of covid and DEATH are already proven. My daughter, an RN mad e a good part of her FORMAL education the study of pandemics. I trust her judgement.
If folks want to not get vaccinated, that's THEIR right and choice. I only ask that they follow the suggestions or RULES that the government set (just like speed limits) to protect the rest of us. I am personally DEEPLY offended by close friends who aren't vaccinated, yet go around in public without a mask - and one of them is sick now.
The forum is about Isuzus. This thread is about COVID. Dennis
 

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That'd be an okay argument, if the government wasn't such an expert at being wrong at everything it does, then always doubling down instead of walking anything back.

The reason this topic is so divisive, is because most people don't know about most things. Most people don't know about how cars work, but there are a significant amount of people who do understand car stuff because it is a hobby of theirs. That amount of people is relatively small over the entire population. Now compare the amount of people who know about cars as a hobby, to the amount of people who know about viruses as a hobby.

Everything we get fed about this is filtered through self imposed political lenses. I'm not saying that one party or another is trying to craft their own unique narrative, even though that is undoubtedly true. The problem is that everything we get access to in the form of studies and news articles is filtered through, and then interpreted by, the presenters of said material based on their own political values, or even their perceptions of what they need to say in order to keep getting paid; whether that be through grant money for studies, or aligning with the values of the publication they work for. On top of all that, people need to navigate the current woke culture, cancel culture, counter culture, etc lest the message they put out get completely drown out by calls of racism or whatever the bad guy du jour happens to be.

We're living in bizzaro world at the moment and it's very unfortunate. To circle back to the main point, most people don't know about most things. I know I don't. In situations like this, people tend follow along with what their tribe believes, even if it doesn't make sense, at the risk of being ostracized. Most people would rather be wrong than be alone. Any time I hear someone cutting down the points of a narrative I disagree with, I feel like me and that person are in the same page, but then if I talk to them long enough to hear what they actually believe, I usually find their believes just as dumb and unsupported as the idea they were just opposed to! This goes for me as well. I feel a certain way about things, but find that I have a difficult time verbalizing my feelings because it sounds so dumb when said out loud. That's because I don't know what I'm talking about. Since most of us have no idea what the truth behind any of this means, we're forced to play a reactionary game where we shy away from things we believe to be untrue, even though we can't fully demonstrate why. So the only thing left to do is everyone point out how silly everyone else's statements are, while never providing anything better ourselves.

We're in a mess, and I'm extremely suspect of anyone who confidently spouts off about the way things are, or should be. I don't know about viruses, but I'm okay at detecting BS. I detect BS at every turn, and in every direction. That leaves me in a no where land of uncertainty and inaction. I'm not willing to rush into the accepting arms of one tribe or another, when I recognize each of their stances as wrong.

So when I'm not getting vaccinated, and not wearing a mask, it's not because I'm against this or that, it's because none of the narratives match my personal experience. I've not even been sick the last two years. People I know have gotten the virus, but they all could trace the where and who the virus came from, and it hasn't been me. It's been two years now and I haven't been any kind of sick. So why in the world would I line up to take an experimental drug where even the side effects are worse than my baseline level of health?

Typed on mobile so probably riddled with incorrect words.

All evidence of this virus points to a lab leak, and always has. However
 

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Discussion Starter · #112 ·
Enemigo said:
So when I'm not getting vaccinated, and not wearing a mask, it's not because I'm against this or that, it's because none of the narratives match my personal experience. I've not even been sick the last two years. People I know have gotten the virus, but they all could trace the where and who the virus came from, and it hasn't been me. It's been two years now and I haven't been any kind of sick. So why in the world would I line up to take an experimental drug where even the side effects are worse than my baseline level of health?

All evidence of this virus points to a lab leak, and always has. However
I can work with that, because we are "in this group across the internet - NOT in close quarters.
Fact: The Government is SUPPOSED to be here for our protection and good of THE People
Fact: they all too often AREN'T
Fact: this virus was going and growing. Numbers were increasing. Many were dying (although it is also a fact that some non covid deaths were reported as covid related)
Fact: this started to come under control (numbers were dropping) when folks were getting shots and the mandates (social distance / masks) were in place and BEING FOLLOWED.
Fact: since those restrictions have been loosened, the numbers are INCREASING again.

Those are the hard facts as I see them (I am against lockdowns - I stand firmly behind our Governor, Ron DeSantis (Fl) and his policy).
There are people who DO know this disease and other diseases. Not all are politically motivated or manipulated.
FWIW. I'm vaccinated. if I go into a group, building, or business, I put on my mask AS A COURTESY AND RESPECT for others. if I go in and most are not wearing masks, I pull mine down. If anybody I will be in close contact with is wearing a mask, I keep it on. It's all about mutual respect. I feel that unvaccinated people, who don't wear a mask, or keep their distance, are not respecting others, or themselves.

Personally, I suspect this was a germ warfare experiment gone wrong. Still waiting to see that proven, or disproved. (It's much the same as the election)
I don't think the government is manipulating this disease (intentionally spreading it), but I do think there is a group that would use this to their advantage.
I don't believe for a second that the vaccine has a tracker in it (don't think it was spread by "chem-trails" from airliners either)
I disagree with people who think "I had covid, now I'm immune". Already seen that proven wrong a few times in REAL examples.
I agree that there COULD be a possibility of future effects from getting this vaccine. I KNOW there are / were effects from getting the disease if not vaccinated. Dennis
 

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The reduction in cases has a stronger correlation with it being summer (not flu season) than it does any mask mandates imo. Cases are going to rise again as r get into colder weather, and it will probably be blamed on the unvaccinated.

I don't know anyone who thinks they are immune from catching it because they had it. I feel that people believe they have increased resistance due to their anti-bodies because the news reports that they do for 3 months, I mean six months, I mean 12 months, or did I just recently hear 18 months?

I know that people that have been vaccinated can still catch and spread it. Oh but it reduces the already small chances of dying. Well, what do you say to people that have already had it, didn't come anywhere close to dying, and now have increased immune response due to their antibodies? Is there anything that can be said and taken seriously while the latest talk in the news is about strains that are unaffected by the vaccine and the need for booster shots?

I thought it has long been understood that the virus doesn't spread from surface contact, dies instantly in the sun, and that there is a strong correlation with how much time is spent somewhere as a function of how much viral load people are exposed to. Yet, the government is still talking about hand sanitizer, I still see people masking up while outside and by themselves. No one is talking about deficiency in vitamin D or Zinc. But instead we're being coerced to take an unapproved drug that the government has removed any liability from the manufacturers and all talking about lock downs. The flu ACTUALLY kills children every year, a lot of them, and schools are never shut down and no one is sent home. I just got an email from the local school district saying that ALL children aged 2-11, or people who will be around them, are required to wear a mask at all times. Why are we most heavily restricting the last vulnerable population? It doesn't make sense.
 

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Discussion Starter · #114 ·
Enemigo said:
The reduction in cases has a stronger correlation with it being summer (not flu season) than it does any mask mandates imo. Cases are going to rise again as r get into colder weather, and it will probably be blamed on the unvaccinated
My calendar, and the 100+ degree outside heat index indicate that it is still summer. Cases are still rising. At this point, I am going to do as I practice with friends with politics, religion, and other subjects where we strongly disagree: Let's move on to something else. :) Dennis
 

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Is it true that the age group with the highest number of cases over laps with the age group that is most vaccinated?
 

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Further, move on from what? No point has been reached. There is no value in a conversation that not only goes no where, but doesn't even try.

Someone on one on a local board I'm active at posted how someone in his family died in a motorcycle accident last summer. The immediate family is in a fight with the hospital because they listed the official cause of death as Covid, after he posthumously tested positive for Covid. After that got posted, a few other people jumped in with similar stories of family members dying of strokes or heart attacks, only to have their cause of death listed as Covid as well. These are people that weren't already in the hospital before hand.

Now, those are just anecdotal stories I read online from people that I know, but I don't actually know any of the deceased or their families. So I have to choose to ignore that when I engage in a discussion like the one we're still having, but I'd be lying if I didn't admit those stories linger in the back of my mind. That said, let's talk about cases.

Cases are up you say (and the news says). Okay, with the reports of new variants always appearing, that's a completely reasonable starting point, but it is no where near the end of the discussion. So cases are up, that about deaths? What about hospitalizations? They are probably both up, but are the up the same amount? If cases shoot up 300%, but hospitalizations are only up 40%and deaths are only up 10%, what does that mean?

It seems like the headlines are only about the cases, but not the other stats? Is that because it's not exciting and scary news? Once a month I see an article about a comet passing "dangerously" close to Earth. Open up the article and the chances of impact are less than me winning the PowerBar. So why even bother to report? Well, science writers are expected to write about science, whether it's newsworthy or not, so might as well slap a catching headline onto the article about nothing.
 

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I changed my mind. I like pretty much everyone here and don't want that to change; and don't want people to change their opinion of me, based on how I view the non-Isuzu world.
 

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Enemigo said:
If cases shoot up 300%, but hospitalizations are only up 40%and deaths are only up 10%, what does that mean?
It means the vaccine is working. Over 60% of the United States is vaccinated by this point. Although they were designed for the original variant, it still greatly reduces your chances of hospitalization with this new delta variant that came and fcked everything up for us. The hospital I work at actually got down to ZERO covid patients a couple months ago before delta, in a highly populated and highly vaccinated area. Now, not so much. Pfizer is still along the lines of 90%+ less chance of hospitalization, and 60%+ less chance of infection against delta. You could argue that your individual chance of death is low, but the transmissibility is incredibly high and it just becomes a numbers game of losing a loved one. If we're playing the anecdote game, my girlfriend's inlaw side of the family held a wedding recently where her aunt (unvaccinated) attended potentially sick but "swore she didn't have covid", gave it to her dad at this very moment is in the hospital fully intubated in the ICU and is, as I was told, currently not expected to make it.

In my opinion, not getting vaccinated on a personal level is a selfish choice. Not the end of the world, but selfish.

I know no ones going to change their minds over a car enthusiast message board, but I'm just sharing my point of view. I don't watch the news, I don't have cable, don't own facebook, and I'd like to believe my opinion is based purely on science and the doctors I work with and know.
 

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If the vaccine is as effective as touted, how is it selfish to not be vaccinated? Vaccinated people have nothing to worry about right?
 

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It was designed for the alpha variant. Like I said, it's 60% effective against delta. Unvaccinated people become superspreaders. A month ago we had a covid patient slip through the cracks and get an elective surgery (where I work). 23 employees had to get tested, I tested negative, 4 tested positive. One of which was a friend who worked in pre-op, and she ended up giving it to her parents. Patient's husband was hospitalized. It just spreads like wildfire, and the more people who are vaccinated the less exponential growth we will have. I really hate that vaccinations were politicized, they are safe and have our greatest's minds working on them in an age of absurd amounts of technology and knowledge. We can only hope enough people get vaccinated (it's free!) and the proposed 3rd shot is effective. The more unvaccinated we have, the longer we have to deal with this.

And for the record, I just want to say vaccine incentives are incredibly stupid and hurting the cause than helping it. Once again, politicizing the virus.
 
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