[ThatOneDude]

Hello, this seems like the right forum to get good Isuzu help at so here goes with a wierd problem... My Axoim, under healthy but not to-the-floor acceleration feels like it's towing a boat full of water. It has good power and always runs well but the thing pulses from 2000 to 4000 rpm as though I'm jabbing at the throttle when in fact I'm trying to depress it as smoothly as I can. I thought at first there was some slipping in the tranny maybe or that the drive by wire may be messed up. I plan on getting it into a dealer soon as this issue has caused me already to spin out at 55 mph on dry pavement going up a hill. I just have the fear that the dealer's tech will drive it around the building, tell me it's fine and send me home. I don't have good luck with warrantee or driveability maintenance with dealership people so I'd like to have an idea what's going on with my wagon before trying to have it fixed. Is it a good idea to contact Isuzu Warranty Dept. before even calling the dealer??

Thanks a lot, TOD

 

[JTK]

I wouldn't be surprized if this was a bad intake manifold gasket. These seem to be causing all kinds of crazy symptoms- while not illuminating the check engine light!
G/luck
Joel

 

[ThatOneDude]

I never thought of that, is that a common problem with this motor?

 

[Tad]

Actually, as far as problems go, that one isn't uncommon.

http://www.planetisuzoo.com/articles.htm/15

You can search here for IMG and find information on how to test for a leak.

-Tad

 

[ThatOneDude]

I just read about all I could find on this board regarding the Manifold Gasket issue. I'll be having a look at it myself soon and then send it off to the dealer (warranty). The gasket seems to be a real likely culprit to me now. Are the dealers well aware of this situation or should I expect a hassle? Again, I do not have much luck with service depts. (I had a manager ride along with me in my new VW once so that I could point out to him my rattling shifter that he coudn't observe on his own and he got me so irritated with his BS excuses for not fixing my car that I nearly dropped him off in the middle of nowhere.)

Just to avoid tunnel vision re: the gasket causing my symptoms, are there any other possible causes that come to mind? I read about a bad battery being a possibility?

Thanks again, TOD

 

[tomster]

I'm kind of thinking it is not an IMG. That usually causes the most severe symptoms at idle. Then the computer cannot add enough fuel to match the amout of leaking air without leading to racing rpms. At cruising speeds the extra air is more easily offset by the higher fuel demand.

Could be a simple fuel filter obstruction. If so the harder you accelerate the more likely the problem would show up. If you haven't changed it in a while doing so may be a good preventative maintenance step in any event.

Could also be an injector problem??, or something electrical???.

Seems odd though with that big of a symptom no CEL has shown up.

Sorry for the vague attempt at help but again I wouldn't fixate solely on the IMGs.

 

[ThatOneDude]

Right on Tomster, thanks for the input. I was kind of thinking the way you were about the gasket and it's symptoms being more noticeable while vaccum is high (idle) and not so apparant while at open throttle conditions where there is much less vaccum and so less air intrusion through a bad gasket and, as you said, if there was a leak it would be less of a percentage of overall air intake during acceleration. I'm surely not ruling it (the gasket) out though.

It really can be subtle at times and quite noticeable others. It feels to me like the torque converter is not locking solidly or something from about 1500 or so RPMs up to around 3000 or 3500 RPMs hence the tugging sensation. After 3500 RPMs the motor wakes up in a big way and she really flys. Do the 3.5s have a wicked powerband or what? I'm used to peaky engines like small four cylinders and even high-R two strokes but this engine surprises me when it gets revved up.. It's spooky in the curves because it just lets loose all of a sudden and I'm spinning the tires. That's fun in a Porsche, scary in an SUV!

I'm beating this issue up here so that I know what I'm talking about at the dealership. You guys have been a heck of a lot more helpful than any service manager I've dealt with, thankyou! TOD

 

[tomster]

Glad you found my ramblings somewhat helpful. Just remember though I don't have a good fix on your exact problem. I would though change the fuel filter just because it is a good preventative step, a bad one can cause somewhat similar symptoms, and it keeps them from claiming this is the cause rather than admitting a more serious problem.

If you are thinking AT you may want to check the ATF level before you take it to the dealer. That can cause some weird symptoms. You don't want them to be able to say you screwed up something by running with the level too low. Also you may even want to change the ATF unless it already has a lot of miles on it. Changing ATF in high mileage ATs can cause problems. If you don't have high mileage then his too is a good maintenance step. It can cure somewhat similar symptoms. Should the AT go in the future you can point to your great record of preventative service. I just have visions of this dragging on with the dealer saying "we couldn't find anything wrong", "it didn't do it when we drove it" etc. Then the AT goes and they tell you it was your fault for not changing the fluid.

 

[ThatOneDude]

Right, all of the maintenance is up to date on this wagon and was done at the dealership that I have it serviced at. The previous owner took care of all the scheduled stuff on time always. It has 40k on it now.

At what RPM should this thing be shifting from first to second under normal acceleration? If I'm not punching the heck out of it it seems to go into second almost immediately, like at 1500-2000 RPMs. Its pretty annoying because more often than not I'm taking a left or right from a stop sign and don't really want to accelerate hard until I've rounded the turn and by then it's in second and lugging when I give it more gas. I can kick it down into first by flooring it but that's overkill. If I accelerate hard enough to keep it in first from a stop around a turn then its tire smokin' and fishtailin'. The power/normal switch doesn't seem to matter from 1 to 2, but it makes quite a difference from 2 to 3 to 4. I usually keep it in the power mode, maybe because I'm missing my hi-revving Impulse motor.

I hate to be too picky about this drivetrain but it just seems to be kind of fighting me all along. I really like the truck for everything else but this issue. Thanks for hearing me! TOD

 

[ThatOneDude]

It's in the dealership now. Got the phone call that there's nothing wrong with it. I don't understand why they would be so resistant to doing warranty work. Maybe their techs would rather do oil changes and brake jobs all day than have to use their brains and shoot some trouble. I'm pissed and the Axiom will likely be sold. I need a truck that I can get good service on, maybe check out a Jeep..... :shock: :wink:

 

[gerhardp1]

I can't help thinking that you are so negative about dealers' service that you get what you expect when you go there - I mean, you expect to hear them say they can't find anything, and bingo, they deliver what you expect. Some would argue that meeting a customer's expectations is the highest quality of service a dealer can give........

With the greatest respect, perhaps you could try approaching a dealer and expecting them to find an answer to your difficult problem. The result would be a solution.

Whatever car you buy instead of the Isuzu will give you the same experience as you also had with the VW and are now having with this one.

 

[JTK]

It's in the dealership now. Got the phone call that there's nothing wrong with it. I don't understand why they would be so resistant to doing warranty work. Maybe their techs would rather do oil changes and brake jobs all day than have to use their brains and shoot some trouble. I'm pissed and the Axiom will likely be sold. I need a truck that I can get good service on, maybe check out a Jeep..... :shock: :wink:

My 2002 3.2L feels like it bogs-down & kicks back in off/on if you floor it & let it wind out through the gears. It's always done it, but run so good that I've never addressed it. I've always just wrote it off as the computer system "adjusting" the engine. Not sure if it's the split-port secondarys opening on the intake, or that Rube Goldberg "ion sensing" ignition system we have. Like yours, mine eventually *kicks-in* and REALLY goes. Is there any way you can disable TOD and see if yours still does it? beware if you try to trade'er in or sell it outright. It's shocking how little our 'zu's will fetch in resale. Warranty work for dealers is always bitter-sweet. Auto techs get paid next to nothing to do warranty work, so if nothing is obviously broke, you are SOL on that. It's the same for any make/brand/manufacturer.
G/luck
Joel

 

[ThatOneDude]

I did give the dealer the ben. of doubt, I always do. (The VW and the Axiom are only dealer serviceable in this town by one and the same dealer, they practically sell and service everything around here).

I picked up the wagon today and spoke with the service mgr. He told me my two piece drive shaft is sealed and not greasable (I had requested it greased due to thumping and vibration). I explained to him that the halves need to be pulled apart and the splines lubed and that the service manual that came with the car lists this procedure as periodic necessary service. He replied that there was no zerk to grease and that Isuzu had made an oversight when making up the service manual. I didn't walk in there with a chip on my shoulder either, we had a professional conversation without confrontation. Each of the three times I've spoken with the service rep. on the pavement he has told me that "Isuzu is aware of this problem but is doing nothing about it" (concerning the driveshaft noise and vibration, the crude acceleration and nasty shifting from 2nd to 3rd gear). That's just rotton service from a dealer and/or carmaker.

I'm aware of the resale value of this car, that's why I've got it now, paid a song for it, I won't lose anything on a sale.

If there were another shop in town that could work on this car (some competition) I'm sure things would be different. I'd have to drive 100 miles or more to find another Isuzu dealer or warranty service shop. Oh well, car's home, I'm gonna see If the guy down the street can have a look at that driveshaft for me. He's a real honest guy who loves a challenge. Why would techs be paid any less for warranty work?

THANKS to you all though!! This forum is a great resource for Isuzu owners. Maybe the dealerships should check out PlanetIsuzoo!!

 

[JTK]

I agree that many isuzu dealerships have little to no skilled isuzu service people. Mine is sketchy to say the least. A service tech cannot live on servicing isuzu's alone, so there is usually a small knowlege base to draw from. The drive shaft slip yoke lube is so simple it's rediculous. Your dealer probably does not have anything *in the book* on it, or hasnt touched any, so he doesnt want to touch yours. Troubleshooting a driveability concern under warranty, where there is no CEL, or nothing obviously broken is tough because techs are paid a book rate for troubleshooting a warranty issue. If they spend too much time on it, they make almost nothing for their day's work.
G/luck
Joel