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5-Tec mods by J5 are a dumb idea

622 Views 12 Replies 6 Participants Last post by  Shawn Anthony
All the Johnny 5 intake manifold modifications in the long term will cause premature failure of your emission systems and overall shorten the lifespan of your engine. In the short term these modifications will cause more break downs. Plus more secondary failed parts with each primary failure. Most importantly it removes fail-safe protection the ECM, igniter and you require.


I will start with the igniter relocation.

J5 instructs people to relocate the igniter from the factory location to the top of the valve cover. The reasoning behind this is to make this part easily accessible when it needs replacement. This is a dumb idea for 3 reasons listed below.​

#1

The igniter mounted to the valve cover actually greatly reduces the lifespan of the MOSFET inside of it. This is because the top of the valve cover is the hottest location in the engine bay. While the factory location is the coolest. The MOSFET inside is a high current device that gets hot. And so the igniter has heat-sinks cased into the body. For the convection cooling cycle to take place the surrounding temperature needs to be cool & the cooler the better.

#2

With the igniter mounted on top of the valve cover puts the MOSFET at high risk of damage. If the ignition coil, capacitor or spark plug wires fails in a way that allows the spark to jump to the valve cover the igniter will be destroyed. There is a good possibility that the ECM will become destroyed too as the high tension electricity will now have a direct path to the ECM via the signal wire. The factory location for the igniter isolates the MOSFET form the floating ground potential of valve cover which eliminates the possibility of this ever happening.

#3
With the igniter operating hotter than it should will change the operating parameters of the MOSFET. As a result, the current draw in the Ignition circuit and ECM will increase causing potentially other major problems.

#4
J5 claims that the igniter is the #1 reason for no spark condition, which simply is not true. The majority of these igniters have performed flawlessly in the factory location for 30+ years. When it fails (or IF it fails) the factory location is not at all difficult to get to once in a lifetime.

In conclusion The relocation of this part will cause only harm to it and the rest of your vehicle.
I highly recommend leaving the igniter in the factory location.
If you like to discuss this subject, add your own thoughts or have questions about this device I will welcome the conversation.
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Since its was a locked thread with no replies allowed, i just had a few questions. Now if the ignitor is under the intake, behind the power steering assembly and the AC compressor (on some 2.6L it was an option), wouldn't the amount of air flow be greatly reduced especially with those blockages and reduce the cooling over the fins? I know the internal "tar" tends to leak out of these over time and that would be considered due to excessive heat. Secondly, all the heat blows back from the radiator fan, off the radiator over the block and head and the back of the block causing the firewall to get the hottest. As well as the right side with the exhaust manifold adding to that heat. Old school mechanics always said the back cylinders get the hottest due this...As wouldn't the coil being mounted at the rear of the valve cover also be a bad location for something that is effected by high temps as stated? as much as i know MANY people dislike John on this and other forums, i am neither friend nor foe of his and just ask these as simple questions to further support or disagree with ones facts and/or opinions. Being the ignitor is up in the airflow, again i mention the 6.5L chevy diesel relocation as the airflow improvement is its mounted up high in the engine bay (on some mods, some are in the grill) and in the front of the engine, like the J5 mod. again, not ruffling feathers, just simple questions for a (Prior locked) thread that these questions i could not ask.

on a side note: I have been building/rebuilding/customizing Isuzus since 1991. I have run Jacobs ignition systems and others engine modifications off the 2.3 and 2.6 to eliminate some of their known flaws and tossed out the emissions injection systems all together and left just the cat with 50k miles without issue on my old 2.3L pickup and had over 300k on an 1985 P'uP 1.9L 4 speed Long bed that had its smog pump belt removed around 100k. I have passed NJ tailpipe/dyno emissions test up until a few years ago, when they ditched anything pre OBD2 for inspection, even safety was dropped...gotta love politicians and the cost of spending money..... my old 1994 Pickup w/2.3L and a weber, it ran cleaner than my stock 2.6L 1990 Spacecab. the 2.6L always had MUCH high NOx numbers compared to the Weber, and often the 2.6L failed for that unless i ran the tank low and ran alcohol in the system as well as mess with the timing to pass.


if you ask about passing NJ inspection and a Weber, a blank CEL (w/ truck off and key on OR while running) was an instant fail, so on the 94 i prevented conductivity to the CEL circuit on the cluster and wired the bulb socket tabs to the oil pressure bulb socket on the cluster so when it was keyed on to check the CEL was functioning and when it started and built oil pressure, both the CEL and Oil Pressure lights went out.....and i passed that part of the test ;)
just asking
Ron
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Threads have been merged and opened sorry about that.
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ok thank you.
conversation is welcome.
Personally I have never had any issues with J5. I also only spoke to him one time.

There are a few different beliefs that people have about engine bay air flow.
I have never talked to someone about this subject that didn't consider radiator location, low pressure and air volcity.

If you draw a level line from the igniter to the front of the vehicles you will notice the igniter is located in a direct line with the lower 1/3 of the radiator & directly in-between the power steering pump. The intake manifold is large and over hangs the igniter by quite a distance. Under the vehicles behind the front axle is a huge low pressure area.
The temperature of any vertical flow radiator is cooler as the flow goes down. This much cooler airflow is directed towards the igniter naturally by its location. while the hotter air flow at the top goes up and over the engine. The intake manifold acts as a shield to keep the hot from above away by directing it out towards the fender. The low pressure under the forward moving vehicle sucks out the air form within the compartment and this add velocity to all the air flow. One law of air flow is that high velocity flow will not change direction easily its is this law that makes the air flow consistently in the correct direction.

The tar like substance ozzing out of any old electronic device from this era is heat sink compound. Its used to thermal couple the MOSFET and the body together. There are 2 reasons why this compound seeps out. 1 reason is because the device has over heated. The #2 reason is simply due to old age. Modern MOSFETS are sensitive to rapid changes in heat. MOSFET from 33 years ago just started to become unusable. Any amount of excessive heat great enough to melt out the compound would certintly result in a failed MOSFET. This is why I am convinced the ozzing is due to old age & nothing more.
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Never really had a problem with J5. Actually, he helped me a lot when I first got my Spacecab by selling me interior parts that i desperately needed - and at a good price. He did some good deeds for quite a few people. Bad side: he could be a hothead and THAT was his undoing. As for the 5TECH, yeah, mounting it on th evalve cover may not have been the best idea. Mounting it somewhere else - maybe, maybe not (I think I moved mine, but would have to go back through my thread to see. I did move my IAC to the firewall and I moved my EGR transducer to the firewall. To me, it cleaned things up and DID make them more accessible.
As for J5, last I heard he was still in the slammer. Dennis
Honestly like these kind of discussions. Here's another one Shawn.
To carb or not.
There is lots to be said about modern fuel injection systems, so why remove them and carb an engine.
To simplify maintaining a vehicle, a carb made sense to me.
No more hard to access parts that fail and leave you sitting by the side of the trail.
To me, old fuel injection systems are failure prone, that most back yard mechanics find hard to troubleshoot. (Like me), so to each his own on how we go about modding our vehicles.
I know the limits of my carbing my 89, (I could never drive up pikes peak) but for ME it was the best decision on my 89 I've made. Going on 5 years now with zero issues.

And as for me and MOSFET, google is my friend, Your never to old to learn!
There is lots to be said about modern fuel injection systems, so why remove them and carb an engine.
To simplify maintaining a vehicle, a carb made sense to
Harry,
Without serious modifications, most EFI engines would be impossible to convert to carb. For starters, most "newer" ones are distributorless. While you might be able to run the ignition from the ECM, you'd have to figure out a way to fool it about all the inputs. Then there's the "where to put the carb?" Again, most have an intake that is designed to supply AIR to the various cylinders, but not a combustible mixture. When trying to run a combustible mixture through this type manifold, some cylinders end up lean or rich and there can be backfire problems (LPG or CNG conversions). Personally, I played with trying to carb the 3.2 in my 1994 Trooper. I was working on adapting a mechanical / vacuum advance distributor to run off one of the cams (driven by bolt on cam pulley) and was working on a carb adapter / upper plenum. Then I came across the 1991 V-6 Trooper, so the whole project went away.
Other than some of the quirkiness that the 2.6s have, most "modern" EFI is actually pretty dependable. Dennis
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thats why the FI to carb conversions are so popular. the 4Z is a great motor to interchange parts from the carb 2.3L to the FI 2.6L.
as far as the location of the ignitor, you also have to consider when stopped in traffic, air flow is greatly reduced and yes the curvature of the floor boards helps with air flow movement like an airfoil, when moving. Also, why the 2.6L coil is ok up on top of the hottest part of the engine bay behind the intake tube where its directly blocked. Coils work better at lower temps. The failures on the ignitor is 99.9% usually just from age, nothing lasts forever. I just always wondered why engineers put electrical parts where they will get hot. Chrysler (enough said there) use to have the ECM for the 2.2L Omni/Rampage/shelby air cooled in line with the airbox, and constant ECMs still fried.
While I've yet to have experience working on a carb based engine - I'll be working on one with my dad here in a couple weeks after I get the Rodeo 'tow-ready' to bring up a '76 MG Midget he's been dying to have for years now.

I've read on Miata forums about a few people who've managed to convert the 1.6L and 1.8L B series engines to run carbureted rather than factory EFI, some ECM changes are necessary to get it to run properly, but it is pretty manageable on a pretty old type ECU.
a '76 MG Midget he's been dying to have for years now.

I've read on Miata forums about a few people who've managed to convert the 1.6L and 1.8L B series engines to run carbureted rather than factory EFI, some ECM changes are necessary to get it to run properly, but it is pretty manageable on a pretty old type ECU.
I currently own a 1970 Midget plus 3 other MG cars. You are going throughly enjoy that tiny little car. Don't wait to get it drivable, the sooner the better.

You are correct, OBD1 fuel management systems are primitive and easily modified
I currently own a 1970 Midget plus 3 other MG cars. You are going throughly enjoy that tiny little car. Don't wait to get it drivable, the sooner the better.

You are correct, OBD1 fuel management systems are primitive and easily modified
Ha, we got it on the 7th, and spent a week trying to work on it, but realized that most of what we would need to get it running is missing.
Dad went back home, meanwhile it's up to me to get it 95% running

The parts and the necessary components we found we needed are here now, so I've got to go back through the book and get it to crank. It's got some missing wires at the igniter, distributor, and the carb is aftermarket, a Weber vs. the original Zenith carb. Planning on spending this weekend rebuilding some of the wires in the harness and figuring out the carb, the spring on the throttle isn't mounted properly, among many other issues.
Finding Webber carburetors is normal on these. The wiring is the nothing special just the ordinary automotive euro8 system. 3 circuits for the engine & the rest on the chassis totaling 8 circuits.
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